SEASON 1 EPISODE 7 with

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Keeping Arts Programs Alive with Used Instruments: A Conversation with Reverb’s David Kalt Season 1, Episode 7

Guest: David Kalt, CEO and founder of online instrument and music gear marketplace Reverb

AARON KWITTKEN Broadcasting from the 10 Hudson Square Building, home of WNYC Radio in Soho, New York, welcome to Brand on Purpose, the podcast dedicated to uncovering the untold stories behind the most impactful purpose-driven companies.

My guest today is David Kalt, founder and CEO of Reverb, a fast-growing online marketplace for musical instruments that has been used by major artists like Maroon 5, Greenday, and Moby to get gear into the hands of fans. And Reverb gives back by donating to music education programs nationwide.

Prior to launching Reverb, David co-founded and served as CEO of Options Express, an online investing brokerage. However, eager to follow his true passion of music, he left the company to pursue Reverb. He started this by first becoming CEO of Chicago Music Exchange, an iconic music retail store in the North Side of Chicago.

And recognizing that few musical instrument companies were providing high quality alternative to brick and mortar stores, David decided to start his own in 2013. He capitalized on his background in Computer Science, to create Reverb.com, with the hopes of making the buying and selling of instruments safe, easy and affordable. T

he reason why I’m having David on my show today, is because just last year, he furthered his belief that music makes the world a better place by founding something called Reverb Gives, a charitable program that donates a portion from every sale to providing students and teachers in youth music education programs with the instruments they need.

Since its inception, Reverb Gives has donated more than a quarter of a million dollars worth of instruments to helping aspiring musicians launch their own careers. And this year, Reverb was recognized by FastCompany as one of the top companies making a profound impact on the music industry. David Kalt, welcome to Brand on Purpose.

DAVID KALT Thanks for having me, really appreciate it. Excited to be here.

AK: You’re one of the guests that I’m really looking forward to having on the show. So, tell us a little bit about the founding. So, you went from, on paper, financial services, computer science guy. Clearly, you had a love for music in your heart and maybe growing up. And you’re able to combine your super skills to really, kinda, pursue your own passion and, obviously, impact others. Talk a little bit about the founding of Reverb.

DK: I grew up in the 70s so, I mean, I was listening to all that classic rock from Led Zeppelin, to Bob Marley, The Police, blues, Buddy Guy, and the Clash. And I just fell in love with guitars. So guitar has been with me entire life. I wasn’t dedicated to going the band route, so right out of the college with a political science degree from the University of Michigan, I decided I was going to be a recording engineer.

I really, really wanted to produce records, and this is the early 90s. I spent a good 2-3 years working in the recording studios trying to perfect that trade. But realized, after a couple years, that I wasn’t going to be a great engineer, a recording engineer. I wasn’t, I probably wasn’t up with the lifestyle associated with being in music production.

And I pivoted to software, and I started my first software company in the 90s in the travel business. And ultimately, after selling that business, I ended up starting an online brokerage firm called Options Express, which we took public and later sold with Charles Schwab.

I built Options Express truly out of a passion and a frustration that I wanted to build a better product than the other online brokerage platforms for trading options. And, ironically, the Reverb product ultimately came from a similar frustration. After leaving Options Express, I wanted to get back into music.

This is 2009-2010, being an avid guitar player, loved collecting guitars, I bought an iconic music store called The Chicago Music Exchange on the North Side of Chicago. I really just dove in head-first and learned the business, learned the art of buying and selling guitars, learned all the authenticity and aspects of authenticated guitars and drums and all the cool aspects of musical instruments.

During that point of 2010, running a retail guitar shop, I started to experience the pain of buying and selling here online. Whether it be on eBay, Craigslist or even building your own website, I realized there was some opportunity to build something in a community where people really obsess over gear, whether it’s effect pedals, amps, guitars, drum kits, keyboards, saxophones, trumpets. All musicians, what they have in common, is searching for that sound, that tone that’s gonna give their voice that special sound. So that’s the genesis of Reverb.

AK: When you started Reverb, what was your biggest fear? I know that personally you had a passion for guitars, but how did you actually learn the business? I imagine that when you bought that retail store there’s some people that you could learn from, how hard was that? I mean, you went from travel to fintech, right? Travel to finance, right?

The common denominator there is you’re trying to meet an unmet, but adjustable, need in each of those marketplaces using data and science and computer science, right? I imagine you’re doing the same, but instead of just going after something that you’re passionate about, you also had to learn the business. How hard was that? And how did you do that? How did you immerse yourself in that world?

DK: Prior to owning Chicago Music Exchange I’d spent the prior almost 20 years of my life in tech, building software, and consumer-facing software. My travel company software was software based and Options Express, so, very comfortable with solving problems, very comfortable with building scalable businesses, hundreds of employees in both of those companies. So the idea of owning a retail store sounded like, eh, this will be a walk in the park.

And the irony is, retail is hard, really hard. I was actually up for the challenge. I love customers, I love interacting with people and customers, I love providing a great experience. Like, in all my software years, experience was everything. UX was everything. Customer service was everything. So when I bought this store, I was like, how can I provide a great experience?

The gentleman I bought the store from had created an amazing visual experience. Chandeliers, couches, more vintage guitars than anyone in their right mind would have in one location. So the premise of what I had acquired was really, really special. What it was lacking was in the finishing touches in terms of affordability, in terms of having great service to back up great instruments and that’s what I started working on.

I really, sort of, brought that UX experience that I had in the software world, I brought it to the retail experience. Now the irony of that is, as I started to build Chicago Music Exchange, to give you a little sense, I bought it for like seven or eight million bucks, being that it had seven million dollars of inventory, when it was doing three million in sales. It was a beautiful art gallery that really wasn’t focused on selling much.

Today, Chicago Music Exchange does 50 million dollars out of one location. So, we transformed it from a gallery to a place that people could go for any style of affordable instruments at all price ranges. Where people could try and explore and remove that intimidation associated with the retail store.

Now, ironically, after doing that for a couple of years at Chicago Music Exchange, I’m like, I think I could do this at a much larger scale in a marketplace and bring that trust, that great experience, that calming UX that I was building in the store with only good buyers and sellers, and removing all the bad players that make, that bring risk to dealing with the market.

So, the genesis is kind of ironic. I spent most of my career in developing software and dealing with customers in sort of a virtual online capacity. I buy a physical store, extract value out of that, learn from that process and then go back and bring that to an online world, which is kind of where I’m most comfortable. And I have a partner who runs the Chicago Music Exchange for me full time, so that I can focus on Reverb.

AK: And it sounds like your original intent is you would have been very happy to turn around the physical store and make that much better, which you did. And then you realized that you can take some of that magic and transfer it to an online marketplace. Cause the original intent wasn’t to go online, right? It just came about. Or was it always going to be there cause it’s in your blood?

DK: The real, real story is I bought the domain reverb.com wanting to build an e-commerce platform for musicians. I realized I couldn’t become a dealer, an online-only dealer, and I had to go buy a store. So, that forced to me into buying a store. Once I bought the store, I realized I had bought the store where I had bought my guitars, how iconic it was, and I really should let that be Chicago Music Exchange and not try to turn it into something else.

So I literally, I forgot about Reverb. I forgot about my vision for an e-commerce platform and through that, then I was able to say, better than an e-commerce platform, Reverb, trying to compete with Guitar Center and Musician’s Friend, a marketplace is a much more inclusive opportunity to bring lots of musician’s together and allow musicians to compete, or to be on a level playing field with dealers.

That was one of the big tenants, why I went with Reverb versus traditional dealers. I said, the dealers are in there to make money and to provide a livelihood. But musicians, in the end, the reason why Reverb really exists, is I really was focused on pricing transparency and more affordability. Giving musicians the edge so they can actually get more money for their instruments and then have more money to buy their instruments. So that was really, sort of, the turning point.

So dealers weren’t, like, thrilled with Reverb at first, they weren’t sure if it was going to be a friend or a foe. Ultimately, we got it so that it’s a marketplace that includes hundreds of thousands of individuals alongside thousands of dealers, and they actually coexist in a very good ecosystem.

AK: And how important was it to get well known artists to stand behind Reverb? Well, two questions. One, how important and two, how hard was that?

DK: It wasn’t the original focus. The original focus wasn’t to do artist shops and to, sort of, bring the artist on. We knew that if we got, if we’re able to attract great inventory, great unique, used inventory, vintage inventory, inventory that you couldn’t experience at a traditional, you know, large big box chain, that we would get lots of eyeballs and we would have lots of celebrity or rock stars behind it.

We also spent a lot of the effort on the content side. So, developing great content that was very authentic, not content geared towards selling you. Content that was really musician inspired. We were able to have legitimacy and, you know, I mean in essence, we’re the David and Goliath, the Goliath being eBay. Ebay trying to be all things to all people, not whole lot of authenticity to musicians.

Reverb was really focused on being authentic and relevant to musicians. Once that was evident, that Reverb was legit, artists started coming more discreetly. We would discover that a seller had just sold their mixing to console to Pete Townsend and you’re like, holy crap. Or Jeff Tweedy from Wilco or Beyonce’s guitar.

So before we started actually reaching out to these artists, we started to see them underneath the current, buying and selling on our platform. And then it became obvious to us that being authentic and not seeking out the artist, we naturally attracted them, and they were naturally forthcoming, like Greenday, and others, to want to be part of Reverb. And actually publically sell their gear to other musicians because they really felt that we were a legitimate destination.

AK: Yeah. It’s a very organic way of going about it.

DK: Exactly.

AK: What brought you into the world of music and how do you feel music can be a force for change?

DK: Everyone has their story of how, in your early development years, how music had inspired you to some passion. To me, it was rock music, and the blues, and a little bit of reggae and, you know, the Bob Marley crow, when it hits you feel no pain. Like, when that real, like the type of music that really resonated with me was just this real authentic passion, like when you could hear it in someone’s playing or their vocals. When you can feel that intensity, it moves you. I’m easily moveable, I guess.

But I got moved by music at an early age, and I never had the chops to be a great musician, both in terms of pitch, and in terms of rhythm. I’ve tried, I’ve struggled, I still struggle. But I definitely feel that music can move people and, and inspire people to go great things. And the music that I listen to everyday has a huge impact on how I inspire my team, how I come to work everyday with the attitude of we can get it done, we can rise to a higher occasion.

And I brought that to all my businesses, even my non-music businesses. We have very jazz improvisational style at Options Express that we celebrated. And bringing music into business I think is an incredible way to connect with people and a way to inspire people to feel connected with their business.

AK: When you started Reverb, I know obviously you have a lot of passion for music, did you think at some point you’d bake purpose into the...I mean, there’s a greater purpose in that you’re creating a marketplace and a level of transparency and authenticity that hadn’t existed before, right? So there’s an a commercial and even a greater purpose there, but in terms of the give back, and what you launched last year in terms of Reverb Gives. Talk a little bit about that. Because I’m gonna guess that you always had that in the back of your mind, but you just wanted to get the business right first before you kind of dove deeper.

DK: Exactly. I mean, it didn’t take us long to sort of get to our musical purpose in this marketplace business and making the world more musical is a theme that we’ve incorporated into Reverb early on. And we tried to do that in the marketplace. We tried to do that, once again, by creating this level playing field, giving musicians great opportunity to basically have access to great gear and hopefully that gear translates to them making great music, which would then inspire other people.

So, we were kind of like a derivative or once removed from making the world more musical. We were, sort of, the supplier of the pick axes, so to speak. It wasn’t until spending more time in the industry, realizing how many great programs that were out there, and how many great influencers, people out there trying to bring music to young people, that we realized we could actually plug into that.

One thing I know in business is that if you’re not going to do something great and you can’t excel at it, don’t do it at all. So one thing that I know that we couldn’t do is, Reverb couldn’t launch our own little academies and after school programs because we were so focused on our marketplace.

It wasn’t until we realized that we have this incredible marketplace of instruments and all these people who care about music that we could figure out how to incorporate a way to use Reverb to give back to these programs. So one of the things that was really important is that we really wanted to focus on established programs. We really needed to find a way to bridge the gap between people who were doing great things. And we needed instruments to actually fuel those programs.

So when we connected the dots it made so much sense. Up until then, we were kind of like, just supporting various charities with money and writing checks and it was, it didn’t feel as holistic as what we ultimately got to, which was Reverb Gives, which allows our programs to basically use Reverb to find the gear and sell the gear. These programs get a lot of things donated to them. They’re actually using Reverb to generate cash, to reuse that to buy the instruments that they need for the kids.

AK: Yeah, and it’s tough because I feel like a lot of these music programs, they’re the first things to get cut, especially in public schools, right?

DK: Yep.

AK: And what’s the ultimate goal? I know you’ve giving away, actually I’m probably dated even in this number, but probably more than a quarter of a million dollars in instruments. That probably doesn’t even take into account, like you said before, the cash generated from reselling those instruments in your marketplace, right, by those programs. What’s the ultimate goal for Reverb Gives? Like, what’s the vision? What do you ultimately want to do in terms of a metric or KPI?

DK: I think the strength is in the programs that have incredible impact in reaching as many disadvantaged kids as possible. We know, I’ve studied this over and over again with NAMM, the National Association for Music Merchants, as well as various programs, that there’s a high correlation for disadvantaged kids that get music in their life that end up going to college and having a quality outcome because they had music by their side while they were dealing with difficult situations.

So we believe there’s a lot of opportunity to, kind of, expand upon that and make sure that we’re supporting programs that have that as their mission and that are very focused on reaching the people most in need. We’re at the early, early stages of being able to measure that and quantify that so some of the investments that were making in programs may not pan out to be as impactful as we thought.

So we’re in year two, we donated a little over $300 thousand. We have plans to donate a percentage of our revenue every year to kind of keep this program growing and not just finding new programs, but supporting the existing programs that are thriving and giving them more strength. We also want to do this globally, so we expanded into Europe, now we’ll be expanding into Central and South America, as well, in 2020 and 2021.

So there’s just great opportunity to reach a lot of people and we also recognize that when we’re supporting these programs that were introducing people to Reverb and it’s not so much in a self-serving way. It’s actually, in a way, because we really believe in our platform as a resource, not just for getting gear, but it’s like sustainability. 80% of the sales on Reverb are used instruments. We’re reusing instruments.

We’re actually changing hands globally now of gear from all walks of life and the sort of diversity of all the music that we do, we really believe that we created this community of musicians that are basically buying and selling from each other and the sustainability aspect of that as well as just the affordability aspect of that is also really important to us in terms of keeping the world more musical.

AK: If you think about it, you think about this all the time, but, just hearing you speak, it’s like every time you pick up an instrument, especially one that’s changed hands over time, there’s a story behind it, a unique story behind it. And that instrument might have actually helped someone avoid taking a wrong turn in life, it might have provided inspiration where there once was none and now there is. It might have just been a simple respite. It rewired their brain to be, eventually, a brilliant computer scientist or mathematician, who knows, right? There’s just so much there, the untold stories that makes it really quite beautiful.

DK: That’s so cool.

AK: My mom said to me when I quit violin at 13, she said, “You’re gonna regret this,” and I regret it. But the problem, this is not just about me, it’s not a therapy session, but I was introduced to the violin when I was 5. And do you remember the Suzuki method?

DK: Yeah.

AK: It was basically don’t read music, just memorize, and there is obviously some good brain exercise for memorization and what not. And I think when you’re told to do something versus wanting to do something, it just has a different outcome. And while I think I excelled at violin, it felt like a chore and I can still hear that metronome, you know? And I do regret not picking it back up again and actually maybe I will now. And I did learn how to read music, eventually.

But it was something, ‘cause I wasn’t really a sporty kid at that time in my life, but it was something that I could excel in and I could feel very good about. And it is a regret of mine. I thought I’d share that with you, just because, I’m not sure I’ve shared that with anybody except maybe a therapist over the years. Music is very powerful.

DK: Maybe we’ll get you to pick it back up.

AK: I think so. I think so. So when was that moment, do you remember the first time you picked up a guitar and not just picked it up but actually learned to play it. I imagine you remember that like it was yesterday, right?

DK: I do and it wasn’t, unfortunately, outside from the recorder, it wasn’t in my household. It was in my cousin’s household. Big drummer and they had several guitars. He had a band, he was much older than me. When I would go over to their house I would just spend hours and hours in their basement, rummaging through all their instruments and just dreaming that one day, I could actually have that.

And that kind of got me on the journey to hanging out at the music store. I’m from the suburbs of Detroit, hanging out at the music stores and an early age. Just kind of, like, going in the practice rooms trying to imagine myself with one of those fine instruments and then eventually getting my first instrument was a hand-me-down from my cousin and then I remember getting my first vintage instrument in the early 80s, buying a 70’s Stratocaster and I held that for, you know, 20 years until I was able to pawn that for, you know, something much better.

AK: I read somewhere that the average number of instruments an employee plays at Reverb is greater than five. Is that right?

DK: Sounds about right, yeah. We’ve got an incredibly musical team here. Very inspiring.

AK: There’s probably music in the office playing, right? And I imagine, is there tension? Is there, like, I want to play this, I want to play that, or is there playlist competitions or how does that happen? I can’t imagine that if I walked into your office tomorrow, it’s just dead silence. There’s no way.

DK: You’d be surprised. We have about 200 people, they’re engineers and they have their headphones and they’re writing code so it’s not super noisy down there. Upstairs, our customer service are chatting on the phone, listening to voicemail, so what there is, is there’s instruments dangling on people’s desk everywhere you look, and cool different instruments, so it’s such a conversation piece to walk through the office.

People are constantly like, “Ooh what’s that?” Or something that someone just bought on Reverb or they’re trying to sell it so there’s a lot of conversation around it. And then where the music comes in is we do have a jam room and we do have opportunities to play together.

Next week, actually, June 21st, it is Make Music Day. It’s a global opportunity started in France, but now it’s really turned into a global thing where were going to take half the afternoon off, probably 100 of us are going to go to the Lincoln Park Zoo, a mile from our office on the North Side of Chicago, and just do sing-alongs and play together as a group. And this will be happening globally on June 21st where people are encouraged to get away from their everyday routines and go make some music.

AK: That reminds me to ask you about the Girls Rock Reverb Gives auction. That was in May, right?

DK: Yeah.

AK: And you had some pretty amazing participants in that including my 15-year-old daughter’s favorite, Billie Eilish. I can hear Billie Eilish in our house constantly until my daughter goes to camp in a few weeks.

DK: We were so honored be able to one, support the Girls Rock Organization, which is a global organization of different programs throughout the world, and then to connect the dots with all these great artists from Billie to Stevie Nicks and the list goes on.

Donating microphones and effects pedals and various instruments and then being able to auction off and raise $40 to $50 thousand dollars to go right back to those Girls Rock programs. And that’s not even part of our Reverb Gives.

We have artists, now we have artists, that are coming on Reverb and they’re asking us how to basically find ways to support various causes that we’re already involved in, so there’s this kind of, like, reverb effect, or feedback loops with that theme. As we are now vetting these programs, we now can actually help artists turn their gear into support of these various programs, which is really cool.

AK: So if you were to pick one walk on song for yourself what would it be?

DK: It’s Tom Petty “I Won’t Back Down”. So cliché. But, Tom Petty is, means an incredible- a lot to me. I listen to him daily for inspiration and he’s just an amazing songwriter that incorporates so much about just America and hope and opportunity, and I use his lyrics everyday and I love to strum his songs, too.

AK: I’ll take it. You know, I would say if it’s real, its not cliché, right? So I wouldn’t worry about that. Mine would be “Immigrant Song” by Led Zeppelin.

DK: Led Zeppelin?

AK: Yeah.

DK: Get the Led out! Now were talking.

AK: It just gets you going, you know. And it gets everybody going. There’s no better, well there’s a lot of great beginnings of songs, but that one? Everybody, I mean, it’s almost immediately recognizable.

DK: I love that in School of Rock. Remember the movie with Jack Black?

AK: Oh, yeah, yeah. What I didn’t realize is that they wrote that following a tour in Iceland, hence coming from the land of fire and ice. I did not realize that until recently. I had no idea.

DK: Cool.

AK: I like hearing the stories behind the songs, as well. Because you’re not new to the music industry, but you’re new to it from a business standpoint, do you personally find it hard to separate the art from the artist? So, you know, when something goes wrong in an artist’s life but the music’s amazing, do you think it is hard to separate the two?

You know people will be like, “Oh I’m never going to listen to Michael Jackson again,” and stuff like that. Just out of curiosity, ‘cause it’s an ongoing debate that I have with a lot of my friends, and I think it’s gonna continue for as long as humans continue, and artists continue to perform.

DK: You’re not alone in having that debate. I had that debate two nights ago with a really close friend about that exact topic, Michael Jackson. He was giving the argument that he can separate the music, ‘cause I didn’t watch the whole Neverland story. But he said he could separate the music depending on the era relative to, lets just say, in the Michael Jackson story.

AK: Right, so Jackson Five’s okay.

DK: Yeah. That’s just one example of how our minds work, how we want to justify something or remember. I mean, if music has historical relevance to you in your mind, it brings back memories when I first heard this or it’s, your associating that sound, that song with a time in your life.

It’s really hard to eradicate that, even with negative news or very disappointing news about an artist’s lifestyle, or how they live their life because that memory is unique to you. It’s a unique experience that’s connecting the dots. It’s that musical sound is combined with some other element in your life totally independent of that artist, how they lived, what they did.

So I believe that the music lives on and the music can be fairly independent of the choices of what some of what these artists have done or do. But we’re living in a new era of awareness and of transparency about how people live their lives and people making judgments about how people are living their lives and good, bad or indifferent, it is definitely influencing how people consume music in ways that I think is good.

I think having a high standard, we should have good standards for musicians. We shouldn’t let musicians live lives that aren’t to the same moral and ethical standards that everyone else has. And I think you can have, there are great musicians that live morally and ethically. So I’m a believer in that. But when you talk about the past, I think it’s really hard to separate the impact on music relative to something that an artist may of done independent of that.

AK: Artists on the other side of it have a long history of becoming, or, are activists, as well. And, you know, we can choose whether or not we want to align ourselves with them or not.

But, you know, what you say about a song sparking a memory, it’s so interesting because I can’t think of anything, not even an article of clothing, because we don’t always keep our clothing forever, well some people do, I suppose. There’s really nothing else in life that has that level of muscle memory or permanence or emotional connectivity than a song or music, right? Throughout your entire life you can remember, oh my gosh that was when I was in 8th grade or I was at that swim meet or that was my prom or that was high school.

There’s music association with each stage of your life, especially your early years. And you’re right, you cannot erase that as hard as you try. There’s always gonna be that emotional trigger. It’s so interesting, I had never even thought of it quite like that before.

DK: The other thing is, once I- after buying Chicago Music Exchange and Reverb and getting to meet so many artists. And I met some of my biggest idols in terms of artists, and ironically, some of them are great and just far exceed my expectations in terms of personality, character, humor, all of that. Others aren’t. But I’m less inclined after meeting a lot of artists in somewhat intimate settings, I am less inclined to go meet artists these days.

I don’t actually want to see my view of the music. And it can get skewed after you meet someone whether, you know, maybe they’re a jerk or they’re rude or something. And you’re trying to disconnect that from the art, but it’s hard to do that. So I’ve, um, I’ve actually, I’m trying to remove some of that bias of what does it mean to meet these artists relative to enjoying their music for what it is.

AK: So true. I’ll admit I’m definitely that guy when I see someone who I’m in awe of when I’m out somewhere I often try to, I don’t bother them and say, let’s take a selfie but I try to introduce myself to them. Like, I saw Anderson Cooper out once and he’s an amazing person in person and in life, but one of my favorite comedians for the longest time was Chevy Chase.

And he actually lives near me and 20 something years ago, when we moved up to Westchester County, I saw him at, like, a local arts festival and I’m like, “Dr. RosenRosen?” I was, like, throwing out all these lines, Fletch lines. He literally walked past me, and I’m about 5 foot 5, 140 pounds wet, right? He literally walked past me and he’s about 6’5”, I don’t know, he’s a huge man and getting bigger as he gets older, and he literally body checked me, like, on the ground, unapologetically. Like, not a care in the world that I was in awe of him. Not a care.

And ever since then, I can’t even. When I see him, I just look the other way and I can’t even watch another Chevy Chase movie. And I’m like, you know, you’re not a comedian, you’re just a comedic actor. You know? But it’s true, you don’t want to put yourself in a position where you ruin a certain vision or a certain feeling you have about someone that has entertained you over the years. So I’m totally down with that, I get that now. But that was a hard lesson for me. First world problem, of course, but a hard lesson. Sorry, Chevy. I’m sure Chevy’s not listening to my podcast or any podcast, so it’s totally fine.

DK: Not yet.

AK: Not yet, no. Maybe now, yeah. So listen David, it was awesome having you on the show. I wish we could continue but I think we’re out of time. But it was just really amazing having you and for our listeners, we can find Reverb really simple, right at reverb.com.

DK: You got it.

AK: R-E-V-E-R-B.com

DK: And we have an app, too. Look forward to hooking up sometime in the future, Aaron. Appreciate your time, today.

AK: Definitely, maybe we’ll catch a Cubs/Mets game. I know who’s gonna win. It’s not gonna be the Mets, but I love Wrigley field.

DK: All right.

AK: Take care, David.

DK: Cheers.